Simply because they have ego higher than the Everest
"Fuck this little shit think hes saying im good with jungle fuck him little imbecile ima do my thing"
I'm no stranger to this mentality, it's just that I don't rotate because I realize that I can't exactly gank a dragon knight unless he's at half HP, or that the enemy necrophos undying dual lane is ungankable at the moment unless a bursty carry/support occupy the lane and are at relatively high hp. I really hate it when people ping me to gank despite the fact that something is hard and risky to pull off. Of course, it's easy to duel a level 7 slark who's still making his shadow blade, but good luck duelling the offlane tidehunter who is not only already level 7 but also has a fucking buckler.
So there's a flip side to this, people calling for impossible ganks is just as bad as people not responding to those calls (if those ganks have realistically good outcomes).
When u carry one of the crappiest pa players ever who got a fucking 30 minute bf, because the enemy team is magnitudes more retarded.
This show the clowny ass shit that happens in 1k just look at the fucking items. The actual play from the people (namely sk and clock) wasnt THAT bad considering we were all 1k shits, but the fucking items man.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2666871377
No i understand that, it sucks being a support who can gank but there is no lanes to gank. That is why i hate having a mid alch because there is no way that the alch can gank or you can really gank for the alch since they have little kill potential early game. Personally i dont want my lc to go for a duel he could lose, bc then that is giving the enemy team damage, but if it is a solo offlane bb and im a jug with a lion and i tell my lc to come gank as soon as they get their level 6 and they get mad at me then there is nothing i can do a that point.
I think part of it is playes do not want to be told what to do and forget dota is a team game in the end.
and imo if you first pick the chance of you being able to ge that 60% is hard especially if you are not a mid player. For example, cookie can first pick arc warden in 3k and prob win 70% of games no problem, however, say he first picked am safelane and the team ends up going bounty roam, a jungler, a mid, and a offlane, while the enemy team has an offlane idk husk with a mid bloodseeker and an lc jungle
that game is going to be extremely hard to win
I played against a nightstalker who disabled help when i was ww so i cudnt heal or glimmer him, and flamed zeus for ks when he dealt way more burst dmg than him and is a higher position. The mentality of some people is rage inducing in and of itself. Which is ironic cuz they rage at everyone too.
1) depending on the bracket, a consistent 60% winrate would mean you're about at least 500 MMR better than the average, but once it starts dropping this value gets lower, so it's all about keeping a steady winrate (improving at least as fast as your MMR is going up)
2) learn what you have to do at each stage of the game, under all sorts of different conditions, that's pretty much it, watch your replays and if you've lost the match, try to pinpoint when exactly you lost it, what decision was so wrong that it lost you the game in the end, and then try to find a way to retrospectively win that match with new knowledge - if you didn't join that fight at your bot baracks, but sold your treads to get BoTs, you might've been able to at least trade baracks instead of just losing your own and dying, take not of whether any of those people actually had TPs and were capable of defending in case you went for their rax, and so on, there's always so much you can do in a particular game, that finding the errors that lose you the game is actually really easy, you make a fuckton of mistakes, just make less of those and you're good, also picks don't really matter hat much as long as you pick something that can win a game and you're comfortable with (i spammed both lc and bloodseeker at 60% winrate to get from 1k to 3.8k)
I think renshin is right, ive played with 2k's who build dogshit items but overall win games cuz theyre way better in the actual game while i cant play dota only imagine it.
^ yeah i have begun to do that lately
If i do something dumb in game im to the point when i realize what i did wrong that moment and tell my team sorry my bad on that.
Problem is with spamming for me is i get very bored. I can spam my morph and i know id win so many more games, and dont get me wrong i love that hero, i just get bored after playing him so much lol
I give it to those people with 400 games on a hero, my brain would fry lol
I actually physically cant play the same hero back to back it feels soooo boring. This is easily identifiable as i have 800 ish games but the hero with the most games is void/slardar with a mere 20. I will begin the spam with huskar because he is a lot of fun to play and he shits on ns scrubs.
One of my biggest problem is that everything I do is reliant on farm
I can't outplay people that well
I usually lose when the enemy team pressures me since the early game and takes objectives quickly
Dunno, man, I don't understand how people get bored, it's like saying chess gets boring because you always play with the same pieces. The reality is, you can learn to utilize those pieces in a completely different way every game, and dota is way more diverse than chess anyway. For me, spamming a hero is a challenge in itself, at some point you're gonna play against your counters or heroes your hero is not really good against, and then you'll just have to get much better at the game in general, not just the hero.
This game I basically played against heroes that either have saves, or are bad duel targets, and I still wrecked them by outplaying them a lot of the time. Playing legion against two counters is really hard because one can save the other and in a head on teamfight you don't stand a chance, so you have to adapt to going for pickoffs where you have an awareness of where the other savior hero might be, which is not just a legion skill, but a dota skill as well. Of course, this was played late at night in EUW, it ended up being a normal skill match so the level of difficulty was really low in general, but at the same time, playing against direct counters isn't completely easy even when you have 800 MMR on your opponents, just in case they might be a bit competent. If they didn't have any legion counters, I would've had much less deaths, much more damage, and would've been able to survive to hit towers as well. It would've been one of those 15-0-3 games where you just buy a rapier for the sake of it. But spamming a hero into counters forces you to play out of your comfort zone.
Actually, losing streaks of short length (up to 10 games) are of rather arbitrary importance. It's too small of a sample pool. it could literally be true that you get bad teammates 10 games in a row, and lose those games because you're actually not a 4k player who can carry them at least 60%+ of the time. If you drop from, say, 4700 to 4300 in a matter of a few days, you could be having issues other than dota, that affect your performance. Maybe you didn't sleep well, maybe you're really stressed out, maybe you're getting used to new controls or mouse, maybe you're thinking about that cute girl you saw at the bakery a bit too much. Like, there are so many fucking reasons to lose MMR it isn't even funny, and it has nothing to do with improving or getting worse at the game.
But when it comes to gaining MMR up to a point where game knowledge matters, being well rested will not win you the games, but not being well rested might lose you some. Basically, you want to be both mechanically superior to your bracket, and be more knowledgeable, and to also think more than everyone. In 2k-3k people just straight up don't think like at all. Putting a bit thought into the game is a huge advantage.
Also, putting an active effort to improve at the game is good, but that's not even necessary, just getting good at what you're already decent at is enough to get you to about 60% winrate a lot of the time. If you actually put an active effort to get better, or get a coach, you can play dota for the next month and go up to 80% winrate because something suddenly clicked and you are paying attention to important things.
I dunno its probably cuz my <1k mmr gameplay is too 1 dimensional.
I literally got from 1k to 3k by spamming legion by following those principles:
1) Farm a blink
2) Get duels, even feed for them if need be
3) Get a bit more farm and duel damage
4) Destroy buildings
5) End game
with about 75%+ winrate at that. If that's not one dimensional, I don't know what is, but I still did it, with the grand KDA of 2.5k
in sub 3k the only way to make people work together is by making a good play in the beginning. i picked pudge a lot, and when i managed to get some flashy pick offs in the laning phase, people actually go "wow hes kinda good" and started considering suggestions like pushing lanes or take rosh. but after some minutes, they lost that aura and started to play individually again. so try to finish the game when the team actually listen, because you may never get that moment again.
^or you can just pick a hero that can win the game all by himself, and not depend on the team, doing everything yourself will also teach you to optimize every single thing you do so that you have a greater chance of success
Wait. So just skip brown boots entirely? My mindset is, just get this blink asap and duel people. I always felt that at least basic boots would be useful, just to move around faster to be in places in time..
Blink gives you an element of suprise and mobility
Brown boots gives mobility
Not worth delaying blink for jungle LC
You only save like, 0.5 second ganking the enemy midlaner if you get boots first, but delays your blink for another 1-2 minute and that means potentially 20 duel damage, WASTED
Against heroes that do not have strong mobility u can still get duels with phase + overehelming odds. U can then go phase armlet in these situations to actually be unkillable unless u fucked up big time
IMO 3k players just dont know how to play as a team. most people have a 1v9 mentality which is good (if you're good yourself) and seem to pick things they want, not need
Yeah, I know, builds are flexible but honestly, it is usually way easier to just go PTA and then blink on someone instantly duelling him, especially when both you and your opponents aren't very skilled. Of course, being able to recognize whether I should go blink or phase+armlet or whatever else in a given game is the perfect outcome but hey... I still need to learn.
Same goes for LC jungle, I see a lot of people frown upon this idea. If you can get more farm from the map and your opponents aren't punishing you severely for that, then why not? And please spare me the NS bracket bullshit because that's where I am right now and I try to exploit what works there.
The only game that i see lc getting out of control is when she got 1 duel kill per min or something like that. Even if she does that she is still very underwhelming with 100 duel damage in 20min when you got kiting hero or saving hero like ww and sd in teamfight
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There was NO reedeming factor on that guy
AT ALL
he had 2 graph on all of his stats, I couldn't dodge him fast enough
I'm no stranger to this mentality, it's just that I don't rotate because I realize that I can't exactly gank a dragon knight unless he's at half HP, or that the enemy necrophos undying dual lane is ungankable at the moment unless a bursty carry/support occupy the lane and are at relatively high hp. I really hate it when people ping me to gank despite the fact that something is hard and risky to pull off. Of course, it's easy to duel a level 7 slark who's still making his shadow blade, but good luck duelling the offlane tidehunter who is not only already level 7 but also has a fucking buckler.
So there's a flip side to this, people calling for impossible ganks is just as bad as people not responding to those calls (if those ganks have realistically good outcomes).
i know that if ur good enough, u can carry ur team 60%+ of the time
But i have 2 problems
1) i dont know how good this "good" is
2) idk how to get good
When u carry one of the crappiest pa players ever who got a fucking 30 minute bf, because the enemy team is magnitudes more retarded.
This show the clowny ass shit that happens in 1k just look at the fucking items. The actual play from the people (namely sk and clock) wasnt THAT bad considering we were all 1k shits, but the fucking items man.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2666871377
No i understand that, it sucks being a support who can gank but there is no lanes to gank. That is why i hate having a mid alch because there is no way that the alch can gank or you can really gank for the alch since they have little kill potential early game. Personally i dont want my lc to go for a duel he could lose, bc then that is giving the enemy team damage, but if it is a solo offlane bb and im a jug with a lion and i tell my lc to come gank as soon as they get their level 6 and they get mad at me then there is nothing i can do a that point.
I think part of it is playes do not want to be told what to do and forget dota is a team game in the end.
I know im as bad as them, but in things like farming and game sense and positioning, at least my items rnt 300% braindead.
Stop pretending you're 1k daddy
You're lower than that
From your knowledge I think your main problem is that you can't implement your knowledge into your gameplay
Apoo has the same problem
and imo if you first pick the chance of you being able to ge that 60% is hard especially if you are not a mid player. For example, cookie can first pick arc warden in 3k and prob win 70% of games no problem, however, say he first picked am safelane and the team ends up going bounty roam, a jungler, a mid, and a offlane, while the enemy team has an offlane idk husk with a mid bloodseeker and an lc jungle
that game is going to be extremely hard to win
I played against a nightstalker who disabled help when i was ww so i cudnt heal or glimmer him, and flamed zeus for ks when he dealt way more burst dmg than him and is a higher position. The mentality of some people is rage inducing in and of itself. Which is ironic cuz they rage at everyone too.
1) depending on the bracket, a consistent 60% winrate would mean you're about at least 500 MMR better than the average, but once it starts dropping this value gets lower, so it's all about keeping a steady winrate (improving at least as fast as your MMR is going up)
2) learn what you have to do at each stage of the game, under all sorts of different conditions, that's pretty much it, watch your replays and if you've lost the match, try to pinpoint when exactly you lost it, what decision was so wrong that it lost you the game in the end, and then try to find a way to retrospectively win that match with new knowledge - if you didn't join that fight at your bot baracks, but sold your treads to get BoTs, you might've been able to at least trade baracks instead of just losing your own and dying, take not of whether any of those people actually had TPs and were capable of defending in case you went for their rax, and so on, there's always so much you can do in a particular game, that finding the errors that lose you the game is actually really easy, you make a fuckton of mistakes, just make less of those and you're good, also picks don't really matter hat much as long as you pick something that can win a game and you're comfortable with (i spammed both lc and bloodseeker at 60% winrate to get from 1k to 3.8k)
If cookie first picked arc warden (maybe not now but i still think so), he cud win abt 80+% of his games cuz he spams arc a lot.
I think renshin is right, ive played with 2k's who build dogshit items but overall win games cuz theyre way better in the actual game while i cant play dota only imagine it.
^ yeah i have begun to do that lately
If i do something dumb in game im to the point when i realize what i did wrong that moment and tell my team sorry my bad on that.
Problem is with spamming for me is i get very bored. I can spam my morph and i know id win so many more games, and dont get me wrong i love that hero, i just get bored after playing him so much lol
I give it to those people with 400 games on a hero, my brain would fry lol
You just gotta see your gameplay objectively
I can see my mistakes without having to watch my replays
Of course, some bad habits are hard to remove
I actually physically cant play the same hero back to back it feels soooo boring. This is easily identifiable as i have 800 ish games but the hero with the most games is void/slardar with a mere 20. I will begin the spam with huskar because he is a lot of fun to play and he shits on ns scrubs.
One of my biggest problem is that everything I do is reliant on farm
I can't outplay people that well
I usually lose when the enemy team pressures me since the early game and takes objectives quickly
Dunno, man, I don't understand how people get bored, it's like saying chess gets boring because you always play with the same pieces. The reality is, you can learn to utilize those pieces in a completely different way every game, and dota is way more diverse than chess anyway. For me, spamming a hero is a challenge in itself, at some point you're gonna play against your counters or heroes your hero is not really good against, and then you'll just have to get much better at the game in general, not just the hero.
This game I basically played against heroes that either have saves, or are bad duel targets, and I still wrecked them by outplaying them a lot of the time. Playing legion against two counters is really hard because one can save the other and in a head on teamfight you don't stand a chance, so you have to adapt to going for pickoffs where you have an awareness of where the other savior hero might be, which is not just a legion skill, but a dota skill as well. Of course, this was played late at night in EUW, it ended up being a normal skill match so the level of difficulty was really low in general, but at the same time, playing against direct counters isn't completely easy even when you have 800 MMR on your opponents, just in case they might be a bit competent. If they didn't have any legion counters, I would've had much less deaths, much more damage, and would've been able to survive to hit towers as well. It would've been one of those 15-0-3 games where you just buy a rapier for the sake of it. But spamming a hero into counters forces you to play out of your comfort zone.
@6 treants
With that logic, is it safe to say that people get on losing streaks because theyre not improving as fast as theyre climbing mmr?
Then that prob means im still at the border of 3200-3300, which means i need to put in more effort into actually inproving than just winning games
I dunno its probably cuz my <1k mmr gameplay is too 1 dimensional.
@bws
Rofl im actually the opposite
I get farmed really fast in the first 10 mins because the mistakes people make are more obvious and abusable
After that i become braindead
eh idk losing steaks just happen, everybody has them lol
Actually, losing streaks of short length (up to 10 games) are of rather arbitrary importance. It's too small of a sample pool. it could literally be true that you get bad teammates 10 games in a row, and lose those games because you're actually not a 4k player who can carry them at least 60%+ of the time. If you drop from, say, 4700 to 4300 in a matter of a few days, you could be having issues other than dota, that affect your performance. Maybe you didn't sleep well, maybe you're really stressed out, maybe you're getting used to new controls or mouse, maybe you're thinking about that cute girl you saw at the bakery a bit too much. Like, there are so many fucking reasons to lose MMR it isn't even funny, and it has nothing to do with improving or getting worse at the game.
But when it comes to gaining MMR up to a point where game knowledge matters, being well rested will not win you the games, but not being well rested might lose you some. Basically, you want to be both mechanically superior to your bracket, and be more knowledgeable, and to also think more than everyone. In 2k-3k people just straight up don't think like at all. Putting a bit thought into the game is a huge advantage.
Also, putting an active effort to improve at the game is good, but that's not even necessary, just getting good at what you're already decent at is enough to get you to about 60% winrate a lot of the time. If you actually put an active effort to get better, or get a coach, you can play dota for the next month and go up to 80% winrate because something suddenly clicked and you are paying attention to important things.
I literally got from 1k to 3k by spamming legion by following those principles:
1) Farm a blink
2) Get duels, even feed for them if need be
3) Get a bit more farm and duel damage
4) Destroy buildings
5) End game
with about 75%+ winrate at that. If that's not one dimensional, I don't know what is, but I still did it, with the grand KDA of 2.5k
But theyre shorter for some while others have theirs lasting for over a month (my bros lose streak was 1 month long abd he lost about 500 pts)
There must be a reason behind this
bryant. This motivated me to not stop spamming lycan
If i ever get u as my teammate in our ranked matches pls dodge my lycan
in sub 3k the only way to make people work together is by making a good play in the beginning. i picked pudge a lot, and when i managed to get some flashy pick offs in the laning phase, people actually go "wow hes kinda good" and started considering suggestions like pushing lanes or take rosh. but after some minutes, they lost that aura and started to play individually again. so try to finish the game when the team actually listen, because you may never get that moment again.
^or you can just pick a hero that can win the game all by himself, and not depend on the team, doing everything yourself will also teach you to optimize every single thing you do so that you have a greater chance of success
@alice
Dodge my AM
dodge my jungle
Dodge my airball chronosphere
Thats why huskar. I was so close to rampaging as him. Same thing with necro.
Dodge my mid
I have 90% winrate on spectre and 80+ on some heroes. overall 63% winrate. I can climb
Holy fuck 90% on spectre is insane
No matter what your bracket is
And I thought I was decent with 70% on spectre
Nevermind it's 10 pub games
@daddy
I've been through countless of near rampages with spectre
Um, hello.
So, actually, how bad is 8-9th minute blink after brown boots on LC?
It's not bad timing but brown boots into big item itself is bad on most heroes, including LC
Tbh I can only think of huskar, dark seer, and enigma as decent heroes to go brown boots into big item
Wait. So just skip brown boots entirely? My mindset is, just get this blink asap and duel people. I always felt that at least basic boots would be useful, just to move around faster to be in places in time..
Blink gives you an element of suprise and mobility
Brown boots gives mobility
Not worth delaying blink for jungle LC
You only save like, 0.5 second ganking the enemy midlaner if you get boots first, but delays your blink for another 1-2 minute and that means potentially 20 duel damage, WASTED
Blink is not 100% first item u buy
Against heroes that do not have strong mobility u can still get duels with phase + overehelming odds. U can then go phase armlet in these situations to actually be unkillable unless u fucked up big time
^Somebody watched the major! Good on you haha :P. The casters were talking about this very thing in game three.
Lc jungle lul
IMO 3k players just dont know how to play as a team. most people have a 1v9 mentality which is good (if you're good yourself) and seem to pick things they want, not need
Just mute everyone, like I do. All chat does is tilts.
Road to 5 it is >Nice!
Yeah, I know, builds are flexible but honestly, it is usually way easier to just go PTA and then blink on someone instantly duelling him, especially when both you and your opponents aren't very skilled. Of course, being able to recognize whether I should go blink or phase+armlet or whatever else in a given game is the perfect outcome but hey... I still need to learn.
Same goes for LC jungle, I see a lot of people frown upon this idea. If you can get more farm from the map and your opponents aren't punishing you severely for that, then why not? And please spare me the NS bracket bullshit because that's where I am right now and I try to exploit what works there.
@Ella Mai
what do i do if im not good enough to 1v9, but also unknowledgeable about playing around a team do i
quit dotaThe only game that i see lc getting out of control is when she got 1 duel kill per min or something like that. Even if she does that she is still very underwhelming with 100 duel damage in 20min when you got kiting hero or saving hero like ww and sd in teamfight