General Discussion

General Discussionphantom lancer

phantom lancer in General Discussion
Dire Wolf

    I can't win on this guy. I think I am not fighting enough early, trying to farm too much. He doesn't seem that good to me though, anyone with any wave clear just annihilates his illusions and he is squishy. Like I am getting wrecked without bkb, and with bkb it reveals you. Plus the counters! Timber and kunkka and jakiro, es and lesh. All this aoe dmg, I can't escape it.

    http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1663829684
    http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1661752806

    Or it could just be I'm on the wrong end, both games had ridiculous snowballers on the other side. Maybe if I get a more normal match I'll be fine?

    When do you build dmg on him, or is it all about illusions? Like are mkb/daedulus/abyssal bad or good items?

    Skadi or heart? S&y or manta? Are vlads and drums still good?

    Ludd

      Well, against that line-up, you're trully fucked because even if you get a heart a full team aoe with those individuals is just gg for PL unless they make a lot of mistakes.

      You need a lot of farm with a PL to win late game, the stuff that worked best for me is having diffusal asap, as it allows you to be very powerful midgame abusing illusions with mana burn and 2 slows. I think I would always buy manta as it is the only way to get some longer lasting illusions. Skadi I don't know, never did well for me, I'd rather always heart + daedalus. Given it's great base damage you can get nice damage from crit items.

      Overall, I think it's important you have good micro with your illusions, for example, when you fight creeps and illussions start to spawn madly, send all of them to an enemy with lowest manapool, or use them to force them to waste CD's... It's very important how you play your true PL around illusions, good players will look for the true one and many times is easy to see if you don't pay attention to this factor.

      Edit: About items I would say drums for poor situations, as manta is incredibly better. I would only go Vlads if need sustainability, if I don't I skip for something bigger. Boots of travel + Aquila early if your team makes space can work wonders.

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      Metallicize

        http://www.dotabuff.com/players/111648720/matches?date=3month&hero=phantom-lancer&skill_bracket=&lobby_type=&game_mode=&region=&faction=&duration=&enjoyment=any&timezone=Pacific%2FPago_Pago

        try my build, aquila+pt+pms>dissasemble aquila for vlads>diffusal>manta>skadi>abysall (butterfly, heart, satanic etc).

        i always get vlads because i always jungle after i push the enemy t1 or after i get pressured out of lane and i like to be full hp kappa.
        it's also a nice early pushing item if your team is doing well.
        i don't like travels because i like to fight more than splitpush and thats why i get le pt, besides pl with travels diffusal and aquila has like 900 hp.

        Androgynous

          skill build is bad. 4-1-1-1 generally, sometimes stats over rush pre 6 if you're free farming that you don't need rush. then 4-1-1-2, you want stats to farm faster and survivability. rush from 16s to 12s is useless. doppel cd reduction can be, but it doesn't help you farm as fast as stats will. kind of like AM blink.

          keep qb for as long as possible because qb got buffed on illusion heroes. 32% dmg to 40%, and PL is almost entirely all base + attribute damage until later on where you might get mkb / abyssal.

          lifesteal is pretty good when you can't rely on dodging damage with doppel like in the ES game. if you're low hp then your illusions are low hp and with their aoe you're basically fucked because they die to pulse nova or whatever before they can attack. if they don't have enough damage to constantly kill your illusions then you lifesteal back up, illusions get tankier, and they don't have the damage to get rid of them anymore.

          mkb is suboptimal for damage unless you're against evasion/miss. the crit damage from daedelus is far better than the minibash + free gloves of haste, even on heroes that already have crits. all your illusions get from it is true strike. what is there to true strike against

          Trodlabundin

            Where is your manta? Manta is what makes PL powerpeak go up extremely much, and you're not even buying it :facepalm:

            Dire Wolf

              Cus he already pops out illusions like crazy and manta one's main dmg is from mana burning. They don't really hit that hard otherwise. But I will get it and see.

              bibi

                PL is great if you are able to pick 4th or 5th, otherwise hes succeptible to be counterpicked. I would have never picked him vs them, unless you first picked him which is a mistakes to do so.

                ф

                  ^^ manta is useful not only for the ridiculous dmg u output but also to dispel shit, with diffusal manta you can't be locked down, add a heart and you're unkillable. Manta also allows you to throw illus in lane and go farm jungle.

                  MadBeast

                    pl is great to man fight any other carry early game with just diffusal, you can even farm heroes like sven.

                    Dire Wolf

                      I think I picked him second both times, he's on my hero challenge list and thus was picking earlier to make sure I got lane.

                      tapir1

                        soulring + mask of death works wonders for me. Then i always get diffusal next. Once i have diffusal i try to show up to all teamfights.

                        I don't like vlads because it seems like a waste when dominator gives better stats.

                        i don't think BKB is a must-have in most games either

                        The hotkey for the tanky (gold) illusion is consistent once you bind it, so practice faking out with it and you will win a lot more clashes.

                        In standoff situations you can harass with your W illusions and send them in to chip ppl's mana, or stop people from blinking. Also once you have diffu the illusions can kill ranged creeps with ease

                        Also i'd always pick skadi over heart personally, the hero dmg really blows lategame and heart does not help with that

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                        quity

                          https://www.dotabuff.com/players/51823648/matches

                          Top PL guy

                          start with Tango and PMS, then quelling blade, Brown boots, ring of health, yasha, diffusal blade, travels, Manta, heart

                          4-1-1-1 just do stats until you can't anymore.

                          Generally stay in your lane until you get your travels. As soon as you hit Level 6 try to push the Tower, Switch between lane and jungle. With travels start to push around everywhere, TP to your teammates for ganks. you should be able to 1v2 atleast. Farm up Manta, with Manta you can split push like a naga, send your illusions to lane and farm the jungle while doing so.

                          Dire Wolf

                            All I really needed was a mid who didn't fucking feed and turn the whole match into a snowball.

                            http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1668133759
                            http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1668194744

                            Also he seems really fucking good vs tusk, huskar and slark. Tusk's snowball is the easiest thing in the world to dodge, then you kill him. Huskar it says lifebreak can't be disjointed but I swear I did. I mean you are invulnerable while it's casting, not just invis, maybe it hits but you don't take damage. Anyway, being natural purge carrier you just purge his heal. Slark, when he pops ult you dopplegang. Between the delay and then him having to reacquire you you can wait out almost all of his ult. And he can't really man fight you unless he's ahead or has abyssal.

                            Androgynous

                              skill build all over the place, no quelling, which is why you're so underfarmed and cant carry. why bother with vlads when aquila + morbid gives your illus more damage, and you're not slowing down yasha.

                              "All I really needed was a mid who didn't fucking feed"
                              same shit different day, 3ks blaming their teammates on dotabuff.

                              "I mean you are invulnerable while it's casting, not just invis, maybe it hits but you don't take damage"
                              thats not disjointing

                              the term 'disjointing' refers to making a projectile that is in flight, not hit anything. dodging is when the you are damaged while you are invulnerable so it does not affect you. doppel does disjoint but lifebreak cannot be disjointed. life break will end if the distance between the life break target and huskar is more than 1500 or something.

                              imo he's also good against bloodseeker too whose aoe isnt that good, and bloodrage helps the PL more than it does the BS.

                              November.Rain

                                RoA, treads, diffusal, manta, skadi, butterfly (if no enemy mkb), BoT, daedulus. I dont think u should ever buy bkb on this hero, just play around your lack of bkb. Maybe buy in 5% of the time in dire situations (no pun intended).

                                skill build always max Q first, then doppel ganger

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                                quity

                                  ^deadalus is bad on pl imo. bring nothing to his illusions. For your sixth Slot get a Skadi/heart to become tankier. Or abyssal for the active, also it makes illusions a Little bit tankier.

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                                  Mekarazium
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