General Discussion

General DiscussionWHAT THE HELL IS THIS FUCKIN GAME?!

WHAT THE HELL IS THIS FUCKIN GAME?! in General Discussion
King of Low Prio

    omg that stack ego........

    Phenomenal

      I'm currently at 3445 mmr on this one and 3.8k on my new one. I dont know why but it's really hard for me to deal with players around 3.5k. I'm not afraid of losing mmr cause it's not hard to get it back, it's just i dont know how to play with them cause they play like brainless chicken. I calibrated on my new on at 3.7k, gained around 200 mmr after that and i'm staying around 3.8-3.9k.

      Trodlabundin

        What's the mmrs of your stack btw?

        I'd guess 3 with 3,5k and 2 with 4,5k?

        King of Low Prio

          Sigh 3k MM players making smurfs and ruining my matches -_-

          Trodlabundin

            if 3k mm players makes smurf, wouldnt they end up at the same mmr? I am 4,5k and I created a new acc just to test it and I ended up 100mmr over my current. aka 4600.

            I doubt 3k players ruin ur games, its just your impression of others doing mistakes, and when you do mistakes u dont really care. :d

            Phenomenal

              Highest ones are around 4.5k overall (Guiri and Havoc), Ducks is 3.8k solo, 4k party and me and Tonks are around 3.5k solo and 3.7k party. So when we play together overall party rating is around 4.1k. We easily get players with 4.8k in oposite teams and usually i'm solo offlane/safelane vs them. Still i do my job fine at least holding even with those players.

              I wont even reply to a scrub like Samson cause everyone knows 4k in NA is like 3.5k on EU servers, so he's another scrub being too smart here.

              Androgynous

                "Do you think it's coincidence they have 90%+ winrate with me?"

                Possibly. You've probably heard of the phrase "correlation does not imply causation" or something of that nature. Having a 90% winrate with these guys does not mean you are the cause for that 90% winrate. It could be the opposite - the reason you have a 90% winrate with them is because of them, not you.

                "I simply dont play solo ranked on this account lately cause i'm fed of stupid players and it's not fun to play like that anymore. I play solo ranked on my other account which is 3.8k"

                So on a smurf you have a higher MMR at 3.8k. If you truly can play at that 3.8k level, go stomp the people on your main account who are ~500 MMR below your "true" MMR of your smurf, you'll have easier matches that you can win alone. Go play at a 3.8k level vs 3.4k players, there's no reason you can't win more than you lose. That Juice guy did it, he was 5.5k and rated below his true skill level. Granted he was about 2000 MMR higher than his opponents, but the same idea applies, just on a smaller scale - you'll still win more than you lose if your MMR rating is below your actual skill value, just not with an absurd 90% winrate.

                Even with a 3.4k MMR, your matches are still in the 'very high' skill bracket. 3.4k, or even 3.8k on your smurf (which is irrelevant to this point) is not enough to be in VH. So that means your teammates (Guiri + Badger, idk about the others) are so far above your skill level that their MMRs increase the average party MMR to the VH bracket even with yours dragging it down.

                "cause it's not hard to get it back, it's just i dont know how to play with them cause they play like brainless chicken"

                That's contradicting yourself. You're saying it's not hard to win games at that level but then you say you don't know how to.

                Trodlabundin

                  I'd actually like to see if you guys managed to maintain 90% winrate in ranked mm. :P

                  King of Low Prio

                    dumb people riding on the backs of players should not comment on others :)

                    this one is amusing

                    Kryptnyt

                      If Tresdin ain't gonna have good time, ain't nobody gonna have a good time, uh-uh

                      Phenomenal

                        Very high bracket starts at 3.7 or 3.8k, so in both cases i'm in very high (solo on my new 3.8k account or party on my main - 3.7k party). Especially on party since our highest has almost 4.7k mmr.

                        If you carefully watched Juice's experiment you saw that he got till 5.4k mmr (which was the lowest of all mmr's he EVER had). He is currently at 6k mmr and STILL has 60%+ winrate. What does that tell you? He will still rise in mmr (my prediction is 6.5k) which is more then 1k higher then his smurf is. No wonder he still won majority of the games. I dont think there are a lot of 5k player who would be able to do the same.

                        I have no problem to single handely stomp 2.5k-3k players, but as you get to your real mmr its harder and harder. Especially if you're not mid player who has most impact - i'm an offlaner. I just dont want to go through this 3.5k mmr range atm, i have no nerves to do it.

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                        Trodlabundin

                          BTW, it's not always that mid has the most impact. This differs from game to game.

                          I doubt a Shadow Feed or OD would have as much impact on a game as an offlane Mirana, Timbersaw or w/e given they didn't have too hard of a lane. With Mirana you could've accomplished a lot on only lvl 2 helping your team winning the early game which often can snowball out of controll into victory just by winning the early game. Roaming duo would have more impact than average Shadow feed etcetcetc

                          I wrote this a bit wrong but w/e

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                          Phenomenal

                            I dont think they've ever heard of a roaming duo at 3.5k. But i could definitely play more Mirana, since i havent played it for a while and it's probably my best hero. It's no coincidence i have 75% winrate and this KDA with her.

                            Trodlabundin

                              yeah, Mirana is very fun. Stats doesn't say very much though. :p

                              rambosalad

                                "Dazzle said he has 3.6k mmr, HOW IN THE HELL IS THIS POSSIBLE WHILE HE'S A COMPLETE TRASH PLAYER"

                                3.6k is beyond trash. jokes on you for being in that tier

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                                Androgynous

                                  "I have no problem to single handely stomp 2.5k-3k players, but as you get to your real mmr its harder and harder"
                                  Exactly, you're reaching your true MMR and you don't want to admit that it's only 3.5k so you make a smurf to try to get it higher but it's only 300 more than your actual account.

                                  "Especially if you're not mid player who has most impact - i'm an offlaner"
                                  Then how the hell do you have a 75% winrate as Mirana then. Unless that winrate is due to other factors i.e. playing Mirana with friends who are better than you. If your 75% mirana winrate is largely attributed to your own skill, then you should be able to crush people solo with her.

                                  Phenomenal

                                    "Exactly, you're reaching your true MMR and you don't want to admit that it's only 3.5k so you make a smurf to try to get it higher but it's only 300 more than your actual account."

                                    Dont act like you're smart if you're not. If you could actually read you would see from my post that i was refering to Juice since he played with players 1k below his skill at best. I was calibrated at 3.7k and i'm now somewhere between 3.8 and 3.9k (depends of a day). Games feel like my level, although i still feel i have space left to get higher. If i was really 3.4-3.5k k i would drop for sure, but i havent and i'm still rising. 3.5k for me is just one of those hard ranges to beat, every player has one.

                                    I played maybe 2 games of Mirana in a stack, every else was solo. I AM crushing offlanes hard, still i dont want to play same hero all over again, that's why i have so many different heroes played. Dont know why i even try to argument with you, since it's pointless and don't care about your lousy opinion anyway =)

                                    Phenomenal

                                      "3.6k is beyond trash. jokes on you for being in that tier" - yes, i'm a beyond trash player :)

                                      King of Low Prio

                                        This guys is what I like to call the 'stack effect'

                                        it occurs when shitty MM players try and absorb their friends MM by attempting to become them

                                        Sorry man you are the same 3.5k MM player you where before you started leeching wins of friends

                                        Trodlabundin

                                          Hurricane, why dont your stack actually not play ranked?

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                                          Androgynous

                                            "I played maybe 2 games of Mirana in a stack, every else was solo." Quoting Hurricane

                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/596457531 - stacked and won
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/596330916 - stacked and won
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/595660786 - stacked and won
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/591625794 - stacked and won
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/595660786 - stacked and won
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/585854351 - stacked and won
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/582046317 - stacked and won
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/580676825 - stacked and won
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/558702461 - stacked and won, this is getting old
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/566994670 - again, stacked and won
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/481370012 - carried again
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/431228188 - carried by Dekadenca
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/431228188 - and again by the same person
                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/427179619 - Deka again

                                            I can do this all day. And in all those matches, Guiri has good stats along with the rest of your team. Being higher rated than you, I'm inclined to believe your success hinges on his rather than the opposite. Not once have your stats been better than the rest of your team's. Saying you've only played 2 games in a stack is clearly bullshit. Assuming it was a typo for 20, even then you've still played more than 20 games as Mirana in a stack.

                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/555932556
                                            Here's one match that appears you won solo and had a good impact on

                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/484210872
                                            Here's a solo queue match that you won but you had less impact than a 5-position Lich

                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/460900451
                                            Another where you pulled your weight for once

                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/481484508/
                                            I don't know whether to attribute this to you, or the Pudge

                                            http://dotabuff.com/matches/361649615
                                            Everyone on your team has ~30 K+A, nothing special on your part

                                            As you can see, a fair portion of your Mirana games have been won by stacking, and most of the time you end up being carried, so your contribution wasn't needed. Guestimating here since I didn't go through all of them, there's about 15 games shown here where you've stacked and won, probably 25 wins were due to playing as a stack.

                                            With a 74.55% winrate out of 55 games that's 41/55 games won. Minus 25 games and that results in 16/31 games won solo, which is about half of them.

                                            FlipFlop

                                              ^such dedication hahah

                                              King of Low Prio

                                                [IMG]http://x4.fjcdn.com/thumbnails/comments/Go+on+_81117a5a760efcf53a17a014e5f645f4.gif[/IMG]

                                                frostychee

                                                  Wait yea, you never explained why you never do ranked.

                                                  Maybe Havoc can chime in here, he's well respected and articulate. Havoc would know if Hurricane's better than the 3.5/3.7k shows or if he is where exactly where he should be.

                                                  eXcel

                                                    That Guiri guy though, what a player he is.

                                                    I can chime in on Hurricane. I play enough with him (and carry his ass enough, haha)

                                                    He's better than 3.5k. He's probably about 4-4.1k and I expect (as he's slowly climbing in both MMRs) that's where he'll end up.

                                                    For me and our stack, we're probably above 90% wr when we are all playing and with proper people for each role, but as you'll see on my played with friends, I sit at about 80% with most of them because sometimes we go as 2, or sometimes we play with people we're not used to or whatever. About half of the games we play are ranked and our win rate in ranked when a full 5 is probably 95%. You can filter through the games if you really want, or you can take my word for it.

                                                    There are much weaker links that I regularly play with; Bishop, for example, is sitting on 3.7k party but I can assure you that the stack (and myself) have personally carried him ~500 points of this and his true ability lies in the 3.3k range (which is his solo rating) so when we play with him, he is more often a liability than a help, but such is the nature of stacking a lot with worse players. Hurricane is never a hindrance to the team.

                                                    As for me, this is not my only account as some people may speculate, I was 4.9k on my other account but this is my main steam account (and the first account I played on, so it has some terrible games on it from when I was learning) it was calibrated at ~3.7k (because of those terrible games, I hadn't touched the account for about 3 months before ranked came out) and is now sitting at ~4.4k solo (I don't solo too much) and 4.7k party and climbing in both, I expect I will plateau at 4.9k, as I was on my other account. I have only been playing seriously on this account for about 4 weeks now, and I don't play as much as I used to, so I've climbed a total of about 1700 rating points in a month.

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                                                    Trodlabundin

                                                      Doesn't look like you play much ranked, but I see you win a lot of them.

                                                      http://dotabuff.com/players/110499437/matches?date=&faction=&hero=&lobby_type=ranked_matchmaking&game_mode=&region=&duration=

                                                      My question was actually why you don't play ranked? Just curious:D

                                                      eXcel

                                                        Perhaps we do play less than I thought, but that is 2 lost out of 26. Far higher than the average 80% wr we maintain because we often don't feel like completely try-harding.

                                                        I don't know why we don't play more ranked, I think we're only inclined to go ranked when we have a full 5 that knows each other and stuff like that, often we only play with 2-3 of the normal players and 2-3 randomers, and as a result, we'll go none-ranked.

                                                        We also have a few players (myself included) who are inclined to go out and come back and play, as a result, I sometimes play drunk and things like that. Unranked is just safer then :D

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                                                        Vandal

                                                          There are always games like that: http://dotabuff.com/matches/625938197

                                                          0-7 Lycan (played carry with support)
                                                          2-13 Bane
                                                          6-15 venge
                                                          6-11 Pudge

                                                          And of course every time a person on my team was out in the middle of no where in extreme danger and got picked off by a gank, they'd ping me a bunch as if I could TP in and kill 3 heroes.

                                                          Zahard

                                                            ow my gosh dat dazzul 3,6k mmr better take a selfie
                                                            3,6k is trash. i got calibrated at 3,2k, and climbed to 4,3k. everything until now was trash. bshit games

                                                            Phenomenal

                                                              So, is Guiri's opinion enough respected for you guys to actually believe it or do i need to bring more people to actually prove it? Maybe i'll just play fuckload of solo ranked and climbed to where i actually deserve to be. Tnx Guiri for nice words!

                                                              2 games as Mirana in party was a typo, i meant to write 20. Anyway ty Andro for bringing up how stellar my Mirana plays are. Did i get carried sometimes? Yes. Did i do my contribution as stellar offline player? Absofuckinlutely YES. You know how much easier is to win a game if your offlane player doesnt feed and manytimes gets a kill vs duallane? In a lot of games you linked i did most or second most dmg in the team. Is this being carried? I dont know if you're retarded or you want to make a fool of yourself, but in every case - you succeeded.

                                                              I cant see how many games i played solo or party with Mirana, but i would aprecciate if someone with plus profile would check it out and wrote it here. I think it's half-half if not more solo. Anyway, i waisted too many time already to reply to those pointless posts of Andro and other guys who envy our nice strong stack. The winrate says it all, no more words needed.

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                                                              Trodlabundin

                                                                Does it even matter. Screw these guys calling you down, but the fact these scores says nothing about how legit you Mirana is, is true. However you might be a fantastic Mirana, I'm just implying that your scores doesn't say anything. :D

                                                                *black*loveu*black*

                                                                Phenomenal

                                                                  Yeah, i know what you mean =) Oh, i didnt answer why i havent played many ranked games. Lately, our stack just wasnt online at the same time so we didnt go as many ranked games as we would want. When all of our stack is online, we mostly play ranked and we win 90%+ of them. If you refer to my solo ranked - i already answered why i dont play a lot. But i will soon, since i got a lot to prove. Especially to myself.

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                                                                  Androgynous

                                                                    "guys who envy our nice strong stack"
                                                                    I don't envy your stack at all because I prefer playing alone to test my skill. The thread is about you losing a game solo in unranked, and the reason is because people in unranked generally tryhard less, so the solution is to play ranked, which you refuse to do because "something something bad teammates something 3.8k smurf something something"

                                                                    eXcel
                                                                      Phenomenal

                                                                        Hardassgame, but we did it again. Gegewhepe team! =)

                                                                        Wink

                                                                          op reminds me of hael, thinks hes good, but too oblivious to realize the truth

                                                                          Androgynous

                                                                            i thought you were banned

                                                                            eXcel

                                                                              Wink, he is good.

                                                                              Every once in a while pretty much everyone gets pissed off with a game, me included. Just coz he makes a thread about it doesn't disvalue his abilities as a player.

                                                                              Only Bogi maintains that privilege.

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                                                                              Trodlabundin

                                                                                ^Bogi is a legit 4200 player though.

                                                                                I doubt Bogi would play better than Hurricane in a team enviroment though.

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                                                                                eXcel

                                                                                  Haha yeah I know, it was just a trolling comment.

                                                                                  And I've played with both (played with Bogi on an alt account before he says he's not played with me) and 10/10 I would choose Hurricane.

                                                                                  Seoulmate

                                                                                    Didn't you just have a huge winstreak right before this though?

                                                                                    eXcel

                                                                                      I was 92% win rate for the course of a week (41-2) and have maintained about a 70% win rate over the past month.

                                                                                      What's your point?

                                                                                      Seoulmate

                                                                                        I'd be satisfied for about a month with a winstreak like that (but I'm terrible)

                                                                                        eXcel

                                                                                          Just checked (on plus) fluctuated between 70% and 79% over the last month, currently on 72% as I've had some shitty solos.

                                                                                          Still not sure on your point?

                                                                                          Trodlabundin

                                                                                            Keep in mind when you play a 5man stack with somewhat decent players who's capable of follow G-Gods instructions getting on a such winstreak/winrate is very easily possible.

                                                                                            Seoulmate

                                                                                              oh, I just realized you might be thinking I was talking to you, I was referring to Hurricane Hurricane

                                                                                              eXcel

                                                                                                Hahaha, in which case, yes he also did.

                                                                                                27 games, he's on 86% wr this month (peaking at 89%)

                                                                                                Btw, nice Invo stats.

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                                                                                                Seoulmate

                                                                                                  Your Luna stats are unmatched though

                                                                                                  eXcel

                                                                                                    Oh, you. <3

                                                                                                    Trodlabundin

                                                                                                      Hey compliment me to srsly. You're holding me out! Oh you <3 tooo

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