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    finally, crystal maiden nerf. ++ Gaben


      Make weirder meta! not ready for more agility hard carry! Do the BKB intelligence thing!

      zoi | hoodi

        No mention of the salve and bkb nerf affecting jugg? It's...kind of a big deal.

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          It's not...

          zoi | hoodi

            Not a big deal that the most picked, highest winrate pos 1 is not at all affected by a massive laning phase sustain nerf and bkb cooldown increase that affects pretty much every other hero? Yeah, you right, you right.

            Spirit Medium

              Shhh Zoi, they might figure out that Jugg is the easiest and most broken carry currently. That would be bad for my road to immortal. Healing Ward OP.


                why is chen doing so well right now bros, everything in patch relating to chen got nerfed
                this is the patch of insane micro, chen and meepo are winners o.O

                aikyu3 SuBi ♪

                  @zoi Dear Crusader, why you hate Jugg and so butt hurt lmao

                  zoi | hoodi

                    Pointing out statistical anomalies that have been omitted is a matter of being butt hurt? Yeah, you right, you right.


                      You are overestimating the impact of salve/bkb changes on jugg, his win rate didn't change at all:


                      He was a good hero, he is the same good hero right now. Not OP, just mostly easy to execute well.

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                      Shockwave 

                        Leshrac patch

                        zoi | hoodi

                          One day is enough to gain a firm statistical understanding of how a patch is affecting the game? It's not important in an article analyzing a patch with two fairly substantial nerfs to pos 1 lane sustain and bkb cooldown to point out the one pos 1 not really affected by either change, particularly as that same pos 1's winrate has been steadily creeping up for the past 6 months? Yeah, you right, you right.

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                            Why are you not talking about lifestealer then? ) Same priniciple, even more so, since Blader Fury isn't a straight BKB, while Rage more or less is.

                            The 100 gold carries will have to spend on salve in lane now are inconsequential for the vast majority of pub games, especially in a vs. Jugg comparison.
                            BKB nerfs are nice, but they aren't changing anything for Jugg vs other carry matchups either, since Jugg still wants to mostly fight around his ultimate CD, which is bigger than BKB CD.
                            The moment they change healing ward, the actual reason Jugg is good, is when I will make an article about it)

                            And yes, one day is more than enough to see that there is no and will not be any meaningful changes to Jugg win rate off the back of a miniscule change. In fact, just by reading patch notes, one would know the meta is mostly going to stay the same. Marci being in the pro scene is probably the biggest thing we got this patch.

                            If you think it is not:


                            Sven is up ~2.5%. He got a "massive laning phase sustain nerf", but he got a +10 AS. Literally, just 10 AS and the hero is in a much better spot, despite the "massive laning phase sustain nerf and and bkb cooldown increase that affects pretty much every other hero". I think very few heroes are as BKB reliant as Sven.

                            Luna is in the same boat: she is a hero who received actual buffs and she is in a better spot. Granted, she isn't as reliant on salves as melee heroes, so she didn't get a "massive laning phase sustain nerf", but the point still stands.

                            Stats reflect changes to hero power levels much faster than players' perceptions. They are unbiased and are a basis for most of our discussions. If there is something helping out Jugg, it is actual, real buffs he got in 7.30 and 7.31. And they were immediately clear on his win rate graph, with a second, smaller increase mid-patch when more players realised how good free lifesteal is and started taking it. What are you expecting Juggernaut player to realise, now that Salve from supports is half as effective and BKB has a 15 longer CD?

                            Personally, I didn't expect anything to change and statistically, literally nothing changed, hence:

                            > No mention of the salve and bkb nerf affecting jugg? It's...kind of a big deal.
                            > It's not...


                              @zoi of course they're right, both about Jugg and especially about your butt

                              zoi | hoodi

                                Trends are not at all affected by the social implications of a patch affecting people's decision-making? It doesn't often take weeks, if not months for people to settle in to a new meta after the rigmarole of trying new things when a patch is released? That win-rates/pick-rates change in the immediate aftermath of a patch couldn't possibly be down to any of the aforementioned reasons or more hence why it's important for all statistical analysis to have a good sample size before coming to conclusions? Yeah, you right, you right.


                                  @KawaiiSocks thanks for the article and for taking the time to make measured replies even to troll comments


                                    I don't think it's a troll comment. I myself have a tendency to fixate on some small detail in patch notes from time to time and hype myself up with it being the "next big thing". The last one was Wraith Pact and I turned out to be right, it was the next big thing. But the one before that was Mage Slayer and... well, you know))

                                    Part of it is also disappointment with the patch. Rationally, we all knew it's going to be small and will try to fix mistakes, rather than change the game, but it's hard not to be disappointed slightly on an emotional level, since I do care about the game very much. Small patch + a ton of stability issues are making me grumpy, for sure.

                                    One of the ways people might cope with it is by inventing something impactful, even though it is not based on objective reality. So, yeah, Mage Slayer on Ember Spirit/Pango and Omniknght Position Three are going to be huge in 7.31d)


                                      man, 1lvl form terrorblade is insane now

                                      den baguse
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                                          I tried omni as 3 for like 10 games in a row this patch. Feels similar to Dawnbreaker, but lacking stun hurts way too bad without coordinated supports... Also playing against puck is a nightmare :(
                                          Gotta test it more tomorrow though. He is pure damage machine lategame, but getting there is very rough.


                                            Some people just like to fight the authority...


                                              @tv/Florimer omg, try to use bkb. and, dont chase puck. he is the most long distance hero that can move suddenly.

                                              for pure damage, can try to use vanguard at begining of time, or use cuirass at late. you got to think about their item. and understand it.
                                              dont be sad.