General Discussion

General DiscussionWhy so much stomping?

Why so much stomping? in General Discussion
Kotato

    Hey, did you recently wonder why so many games end in stomping? Wonder why now so many games lost already at their pick?

    I tell you why.

    This is the outcome of main trend in buffing heros. Looks Icefrog has been changing heroes so that they will excel at their main abilities/skillsets and tricks. Example LC is all about her ultimate so Icefroggy made duel accumulation to be +26 damage and not 18 as before, plus that sweet +40 damage bonus as lvl 25, other buffs like 2nd skill after duel is also about duel.

    Other example with slark now stealing agility from heroes and his again is also about specifically slark skill - running away in the fog. Plenty of examples like this.

    But what do we get in the end? We get the meta where each hero is good at what he is doing (like huskar jumping enemies), and therefore counterpicks are even more counter than before. If before witch doctor and shadow shaman and lion did similar thing, now in a late game they are pretty different in terms of set-ups and game styles: lion is one-shot nuke, shaman is all about infinte shackles after his ult, and witch doctor casking (10 casks) the shit out of the enemies in a badly placed teamfight.

    So the picks are amplified and therefore the penalty for picking badly is increased! Here comes the foundation of your stomping pattern while you are the children of the previous comeback-meta can not grasp it... well, hello there, it is 2019

    JDF8

      Icefroggy made duel accumulation to be +26 damage and not 18 as before

      Whaaaaaat? how did I miss this holy fuck

      Feachairu

        the meta is about stomping right now,kills give alot of exp and tower is easier to destroy with armor reductions i think

        Inflation Agent

          Not in 3k bracket. We dont know meta is a Thing Pepega

          Talker

            WD was never similar to SS or Lion - unreliable 1sec stun.

            WD has different uses - some (meta players) are using it as healer. I am using WD as kill potential support (maledict), who can just stomp enemy with damage dealing carry from lvl 2 onwards to snowball into aghs damage dealer in teamfights.

            Marko Bulat

              ^You are wrong, cask is such a nuance when you drop it in a middle of teamfight.

              But i agree with Story Time, this meta sucks dicks, how boring it is speaks fact that over the weekend 80% of my friendlist are playing chess, new patch when?

              Kotato

                ^no one knows, but AUTO-CHESS is the new patch

                Marko Bulat

                  Seems like it, nobody is interested in dota anymore, including popular streamers, thats what you get when you nerf comeback mechanic and only killing hero with a kill streak gives insane gold and exp, like we needed deathball meta 2.0... Such trash patch with 4 braindead playable core heroes and who has the most cancerous offlane xd wombo-combo competition...

                  o`hanra hanrahan

                    well, in 3K bracket, its litterly whoever last-picks AM, or a PA or sometimes Drow, wins the game, 0 chance to do anything, AM just afk farms untill the 30 min mark, PA is just doing PA stuff, and Drow just gets ahead early, making your team usually get annoyed and toxic, which always results in bad games, i really do not understand how if teams arent gonna pick it, just ban it, but no, 3K mmr doesnt understand anything, they only believe their hero is the best hero, even though its a hero with 5% winrate, and looking at their dotabuff stats, they dont even pick a main hero... thats the actual problem, so yes, you do litterly lose during pick/ban phase 90% of the time

                    Feachairu

                      what if you pick am pa drow at the same time on 1 team in 3k bracket,100% win?

                      Jack__Attack

                        @travis. Interesting. I seem to have the most trouble myself going against juggernaut every second game.

                        Pa isnt an issue anymore, drow never was an issue.
                        Am free farming till 30mins? Rofl my games are over in 25-30mins every game anyways. My games are 3k too.

                        Marko Bulat

                          ^Yes, game last long enough for 5 cores to get omegafarm!

                          o`hanra hanrahan

                            i mean, im a support player, i prety much always either ban PA or AM (sometimes axe, if i play dazzle) i really dont like that counterpick :( but its also because how people understand the game, to me, it seems very simple, dont wanna play AM, PA, drow, or even something like medusa, then atleast ban them, but they dont do that either, its like meepo ban, riki ban, and sometimes AM. but there is another thing that makes it inpossible, i simply only play on EUW server, yet, i had 2 games in a row with 4 russians in my team, no teamwork, they dont speak english, they somehow dont understand meta, they pick meepo mid and yell in their microphone, russian supports who simply refuse to ward, thats a even bigger problem, not to mention the infinite disconnects, the feed when they die 2 times, im going a bit on a tantrum here, but my god, losing because you get teamed with 4 russians who dont do anything but feed, is just absurd, like think about it, you play on NA, you get teamed with 4 people from china? that is just retarded, same for EUW and i get 4 russians.. twice, meepo mid, feeds 0/8 then quits, thats litterly my 3K bracket matches 50% of the time, its absurd

                            BABING

                              Im still realizing BS's Ult doesn't kill you LOL It is Very true. You can Stomp. in a Match OR lose Horribly before the game even starts. That's what i feel in my 1k matches now. Team Cant Counter pick.

                              Jack__Attack

                                @travis Guess, there is a difference between EU and NA meta then even for 3k. US east only gets paired with peruvians and Hispanic. I luckily speak Spanish. US west gets paired with Chinese and pinoys. Rarely do I end up in the same problem you have with russians.

                                Sixe史吏

                                  The Chinese players on USE are students studying in the USA.

                                  Meta is stompy because towers are easy to kill and comeback mechanics were nerfed. This means that win lane + win mid-game = 1+ lane of rax at 20 minutes = GG.

                                  @Travis
                                  You mean to tell me people don't counterpick AM/Drow in lane? Even in my shit bracket, most players play Bristle or Axe if they see AM or PA or Jugg in lane and Slark or PA vs. Drow. It usually messes them up pretty hard.
                                  The bans on meepo probably reflect the high number of smurfs and boosters in EUW from the Russian players (especially at 3k), and most Russian players hate buying sentries so the bans on riki and techies make sense. You see similar Techies bans in CN.

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                                  o`hanra hanrahan

                                    @Jack Attack ahh, i just dont like language barries.. i mean i dont mind it, but in a pretty heavy focused team-game, where you have russians who simply refuse to speak english (but if they get upset, they do ping you 300 times) like some matches i actually got reported simply for not being russian, even though its them playing on EUW servers, i dont play on Russia servers, because i dont want them in my games, yet they always end up sometimes with 3/4 in my team, litterly a lost game because of a langauge barrier, i think its retarded, like im actually upset if i lose because of dumb reasons like that, but i guess it happens often in 3K, since today its almost only russians in my teams, not a single english speaking person almost, i dont understand how it works like that, but it really sucks to keep losing matches because of it

                                    vygin

                                      NA DOTO > EU DOTO ?

                                      SirIronSights

                                        Is it wrong for me to think that lion is now a better counter to meepo than es? It's just looking like that, because es is IMBA as fuck, and lion needs a buff honestly

                                        Sixe史吏

                                          Meepo is weaker to burst than AoE because all the Meepos die if you kill only one of them. For AoE to be effective, it needs to heavy, sustained AoE like Sven or OD with Q + Ulti (because even if it's not fatal to the Meepos, it makes every one of the clones very weak, making it harder for the Meepo player to save himself because he must then hide all the Meepos rather than merely the one at low HP). In most cases, ES' nuke isn't enough (because of how much stats Meepo likes to build), and ES > Axe and SK in the early/mid-game in terms of damage output.

                                          o`hanra hanrahan

                                            nah its just russians, i played a game a few min ago, i told them, if you arent gonna pick AM/PA/Drow, or medusa, atleast ban them
                                            but it appears once again, there were 4 russians in my team, they didnt ban anything, so ofcourse enemy insta locks PA, and ofcourse a sniper mid, they both stomped, obviously because my 4 russian teammates litterly screamed through their mics in jibberish for the first 5 min, and then i had to mute, once again, all 4 of my teammates, so its litterly a loss even before pick/ban phase, its whoever has the most russians, loses, they dont pick meta, they cant speak english, they refuse to ban for whatever god knows why reason, and they play on EUW server... i mean this is just retarded, every of my fucking losses, is due to being teamed with 4 russians, again and again, its litterly a loss before the pick/ban phase, isnt that just sad, i litterly looked, in my past 8 matches, i was teamed with 20 russians, yeah do the math, but its litterly i lost every match due to no communication, it may sounds like i have a thing against russians, and no IRL i do not, in this game however, they are utterly retarded, there is litterly not a single % chance to win, they wont even ban any heros, they just insta lock some random hero they never played, they cant speak english, what the actual fuck can you do, how on earth is anyone supposed to win a match, with 4 people who all dont understand me, who all feed and rage after 2 deaths, even when i was 2K i had better teammates then this, its litterly 90% are russian feeders, troll pickers, rage-quiters, thats pretty much 3K bracket in a nuttshell, its a real shame, the actual games where im not teamed with 4 russians, are so god damn enjoyable, its really good and fun games if people atleast pick/ban, its like im not even playing dota, its just 4 bots it feels like, its boring, annoying, and i dare to say cancerous to be teamed with 4 russians in 90% of my games, that you pretty much lost since the second they were put in my team...

                                            Player 281121816

                                              Hypocrite mage, doggernaut, feminazi ass”sin, dog ranger need huge nerf. U can pick they all four and still winning the game

                                              Player 281121816

                                                Oh yeah, and that fuckin frog asshole slork too. Its not fun if u cant even use tp, thx to leashed fuckin broken mechanic

                                                Marko Bulat

                                                  ^Leash is dogshit spell, was literaly useless until this patch because it can interupt TPs now, you can forcestaff yourself out of it, or if you dont want to buy forcestaff, just get ironwood branch and ty "?" to Slark. This bug if its even a bug will apparently never be fixed so you can counter Slark leash with 50g...

                                                  Feachairu

                                                    what,how do you counter pounce with branch

                                                    BABING

                                                      Impossible? Its just a tree? It wont stop pounce...

                                                      Marko Bulat

                                                        what,how do you counter pounce with branch

                                                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9S7atJLkz00

                                                        0:47 Try in demo, very easy and very old, Branch will move you forward when you are max ranged in leash, its a simple mechanical trick, in dota mechanics Branch tree is registered as an object and in doto 2 objects cant ocupy same space in the same time so it will tilt you forward just enough to break the leash. ezpz

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                                                        ubica

                                                          but then you have an iron branch

                                                          Feachairu

                                                            that's nice,thanks
                                                            i cant summon heroes since i dont know the command on demo modes

                                                            Marko Bulat

                                                              ^ " -createhero Slark enemy"

                                                              Akeel

                                                                And I was just thinking of spamming slark before the season resets

                                                                ubica

                                                                  i have not once seen this play made in my game as a slark, lol.

                                                                  Marko Bulat

                                                                    ^Happens in my bracket thats why slark is last of the 5 playable pos 1 heroes in this patch with shitty 46% winrate, Jug and PA tho, simply amazing

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                                                                    o`hanra hanrahan

                                                                      all slarks in my bracket are god awfull, i have beaten slarks easily, and when they were in my team, they got destroyed too, maybe its just 3K bracket that its bad, but they just seem to have no input beyond lane phase, like i dont know 3K slark is pure garbage, doesnt do shit, or rather, people dont know how to do shit with it

                                                                      ubica

                                                                        and what bracket is that? you look like a losing legend 1

                                                                        Tribo

                                                                          Auto chess is for disabled people who suck at chess

                                                                          mynhauzen

                                                                            @Travis B, I'm Russian myself who lives in US West now. I understand the feeling, but you should play in other servers to get a different perspective. I don't blame you for being actually really rude, tho I understand that from your point of view, every Russian is rude with you, which is not true.

                                                                            I actually enjoy playing with Russians more than with USWest "Russians" = Spanish speakers that are extremely toxic, report everyone every game, don't like wrong picks (e.g., Arc Warden) or if your KDA is less than 20:0. They don't try to learn English, have odd style of playing, etc. There are other nationalities here that have their own style in the game, that collectively report you, etc. I actually noted preference in the game that I want to play only with English speakers and Russian speakers. I think its a Dota+ feature, and my experience improved significantly. In US, 50% of my games have a Russian in a team. Most of them play above average for my MMR, understand the game better and know English. You're just looking at the wrong population of Russians and assume its all the same. Get Dota + and you won't play with Russians for a while. Just put languages to English and Spanish or something like that.

                                                                            You also notice the loudest Russians, but Russians are generally significantly quieter than other nationalities in EU (e.g., Spanish, Italians, Germans). Other games have larger communities from EU, and it gets as annoying. I'd say - get dota + and stop being nationalistic. Its not about Russians. Its about you playing a free game on the most popular platform (PC) and complain that there's a large community of folks from another poorer region dominating presence in your games. Grow up. Get X-Box and play games only Germans can afford (and enjoy reports from just Germans). Or get Dota +.

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                                                                            o`hanra hanrahan

                                                                              @mynhauzen oh no its quite the opposite, i actually do love russia, its people and its culture, its still on my list of countries to visit sometime, but again, thats trivial, i have dota+ i actually play ranked roles, and its just that. russians dont play on russian servers, because their own toxicity makes it so they spread it, thats the whole thing, my argument is just, they always seem to not communicate (with eachother) or me obviously because i dont speak russian, they die 2 times, ping everyone, they also usually like to report the non-russians because thats a thing, and they never pick/ban meta, meepo first pick, supports not wanting to play support but instead be a lich off-lane, even though in the draft he picked support, so if im support, i bassicly have to ward each side, otherwise some dumb fuck is spamming pings like crazy, yeah, great game if its played like that right, and this is a MAJORITY of russians, not all, but most, if i have game with 2 french, a german, and someone from the UK, there are almost zero to none of these issues, sure they can be bad played, but every country has those, i just dont like to lose to boring shit like that, for me russians, really do ruin the whole gaming experience, even more if i get teamed by 4... its litterly braindead losing by 2 min because some guy thinks its gg and sits in base, yes, this is russian 3K dota, pure an utter annoying behaviour, + a boring 10 min loss with 20 kills to none, yeah every russian game i experienced in my bracket, is like that, without russians.. my god, i enjoy the game alot, there is teamwork, there are meta picks/bans, i can ask if they want me to go off/save lane support, and who i should pick.. none of that is ever happening with 4 russians, its just a sad and annoying experience for me, that is all